Butia

[andycorn]

Repotting a large butia from 40 liters to 90 what potting mix would palm experts recommend

[Yorkshire Kris]

I would use a similar mix to what it's currently in.

[multim]

I'm no expert but do grow palms in pots to good effect using Westland multi-purpose compost with added John Innes. + plus extra grit and perlite for drainage. Good drainage being most important.
Interestingly enough, many of the palms I have bought from The Palm Centre are potted in, what appears to be, coir and nothing else. Perhaps the lightness (in weight) saves on shipping costs?

[Yorkshire Kris]

[quote="multim"]I'm no expert but do grow palms in pots to good effect using Westland multi-purpose compost with added John Innes. + plus extra grit and perlite for drainage. Good drainage being most important.
Interestingly enough, many of the palms I have bought from The Palm Centre are potted in, what appears to be, coir and nothing else. Perhaps the lightness (in weight) saves on shipping costs?[/

Thequote]

The trouble is if you use a good free draining mix when you water the palm you risk a lot of the water passing though and out of the pot without wetting the original 40ltr root ball.

I experienced the opposite of this with a waggy in a pot which always felt moist around the top of the pot but the original root ball was powder dry when I investigated! So thats why I say use a similar medium that its currently growing in.

[multim]

So if that's the case, then please ignore my advice if you wish............and at your peril! But I'll bet that the original potting medium is well drained.

[Yorkshire Kris]

So if that's the case, then please ignore my advice if you wish............and at your peril! But I'll bet that the original potting medium is well drained.

I totally agree with the mix you've suggested I used similiar here.





It's just that if the plant in a 40litre pot has a very different mix e.g. very water retentive or super free draining then when transferrred to a 90 litre pot and add the suggested mix then when you water it it can pass straight through without going near the original rootball. Just something I've found when repotting quite a few biggish palms. With smaller pot sizes this doesn't matter as much as the roots quickly grow into the new medium.

[multim]

At least I did suggest a suitable medium for potting-on. The mix I suggested will retain moisture and will drain the surplus without the compost from becoming sodden and sour. How often do we hear the term 'moist but well drained'? And 'water well until established'?
It's fine advice saying '' use a similar medium which it's growing in'' Good advice indeed, but he will be greeted by a somewhat bemused garden centre employee after having shown them a handful of dirt (compost) and then asking ''please can I have 50 litres of this''.
As for watering plants in pots;
The good old Victorian gardeners used to tap the terracotta pots to see if it 'rang', that being the case, it needed water.
These days are different, and terracotta pots are little used. In their place, we have plastic and pre-formed ceramic stoneware. By lifting or tipping the pot, experience will tell you if the plant needs watering or not simply by the weight. Surface, damp-to-the-touch method will not give much indication as to the moisture within the pot.

[Yorkshire Kris]

At least I did suggest a suitable medium for potting-on. The mix I suggested will retain moisture and will drain the surplus without the compost from becoming sodden and sour. How often do we hear the term 'moist but well drained'? And 'water well until established'?
It's fine advice saying '' use a similar medium which it's growing in'' Good advice indeed, but he will be greeted by a somewhat bemused garden centre employee after having shown them a handful of dirt (compost) and then asking ''please can I have 50 litres of this''.
As for watering plants in pots;
The good old Victorian gardeners used to tap the terracotta pots to see if it 'rang', that being the case, it needed water.
These days are different, and terracotta pots are little used. In their place, we have plastic and pre-formed ceramic stoneware. By lifting or tipping the pot, experience will tell you if the plant needs watering or not simply by the weight. Surface, damp-to-the-touch method will not give much indication as to the moisture within the pot.

Fair point , I should have given a fuller answer first time round.

[countrylover]

To those who visit sometimes The GardenWeb Forums 5:1:1 mix or gritty mix must be familiar. Anyone tried them?

[Birmingham Chris]

I feel as though I may be interferring between you two here, and am no means as experienced as you guys (although fairly successful at what I do!!), but my first thought when I read the thread was that very free draining compost (particularly coir or peat based** compost) in pots would surely leak nutrients away really quickly? I have had good success with soil and / or sandy soil laid over plenty of rubble in pots, as it holds water well before it drains and doesn't seem to have the unfathomable 'top wet / bottom dry' syndrome. Just a thought.....but as I say: you both seem to have more deep-seated opinions than me! Guess a part of it depends on whether you have the time to water every day / feed regularly / money to spend etc, which I (unfortunately) don't!!



**peat: come on guys: it's an environmental disaster!! If people who are passionate about gardening and plants use it, then what are we doing?! (I realise no-one mentioned peat-based, but it is obviously free-draining and I am sure a lot of people on here use it. There are some like-for-like alternatives which don't require the destruction of ecosystems).

[countrylover]

Many nursery growers use coir nowadays. Not only because it's cheap, lightweight and has good water/air balance. Most important is coir does not deteriorate very quickly, which means coir stays coir for a long time. Other compost or peat based media deteriorate very quickly usually within one growing season and roots end up in something like compacted dust or mud.
To enhance drainage it is wise to mix your medium with perlite or expanded clay. But again when compost deteriorates it sticks to the enhancers and they lose their properties.
For a long term potting medium we should use something that will last for a long time. So coir or pine bark are good options - they will keep moisture alright. Added lava stones, perlite etc will improve drainage. And no problem with watering- just water till it drains thru the whole rootball. The roots won't suffocate.
If some extra moisture is needed there are superabsorbents we can mix with our media- they will also store nutrients.

[multim]

I think we're drifting off-topic somewhat............however,

I too would prefer to use an alternative to peat and over the years I have tried most.
Coir blocks or bricks were available some years ago, rehydrate in water = a bucket of potting media...simple, but where are they now?
And just a few years ago there was a compost marketed by Diarmuid Gavin as a natural alternative to peat. I tried this too and this was the worst compost I have ever used as it contained un-decomposed paper and shreds of plastic. Total rubbish in more ways than one. Similarly is the stuff from the council recycling depot.
I would like to buy pine needles as a natural mulch and to add acidity to the soil, but cannot find any to buy. Although I do have a 'forage' for some.
I sometimes add bark to compost mix after running it through the shredder a few times to reduce the size.

I will continue to try 'enviro-friendly' as and when they are commercially available.