What brand of high nitrogen are you using for bananas

[tropical Tom]

miracle grow has an NPK of 36-6-6

Chempak has an NPK of 25-15-5

so .... miracle grow works out to 6-1-1

and Chempak works out to 5-3-1

so .... they are both very similar, with Chempack having a higher P ... and both have added trace elements

both when used frequently will add lots of harmful salts to the soil ...

a product such as Advanced Nutrients iguana juice grow is 100% organic, has and N-P-K of 3-1-3

made from fish extract, guano, earthworm castings, yucca, krill, alfalfa, volcanic ash and other 100% organic ingredients which include over 70 trace elements

costs £20 for a 1 litre bottle, but it is diluted at 4ml per litre of water, so, for £20 you get 250 litres of liquid fertilizer that can be used as a soil drench, or as a foliar feed

I've been using Iguana grow for a while now and everything has responded very well, and I am switching away from synthetic fertilizers and trying the organic way now (I still currently use synthetic on lawns though)

thats the way I see it, but I may be wrong?

Sorry you are wrong, the Chempak is 25:15:15 and as a ratio that's 1.7:1:1 the Miracle Gro is 6:1:1 a MASSIVE difference !!!

The miracle grow I have clearly states a ratio of 24:8:16

[GaryW]

^ We were talking about the Miracle Gro lawn feed not the std Miracle Gro

[fieldfest]

human urine is approximately 11-1-2 by one study[18] or 15-1-2 by another report according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urine#Chemical_analysis

just waz all over your nanas and save a fortune!

[Dim]

miracle grow has an NPK of 36-6-6

Chempak has an NPK of 25-15-5

so .... miracle grow works out to 6-1-1

and Chempak works out to 5-3-1

so .... they are both very similar, with Chempack having a higher P ... and both have added trace elements

both when used frequently will add lots of harmful salts to the soil ...

a product such as Advanced Nutrients iguana juice grow is 100% organic, has and N-P-K of 3-1-3

made from fish extract, guano, earthworm castings, yucca, krill, alfalfa, volcanic ash and other 100% organic ingredients which include over 70 trace elements

costs £20 for a 1 litre bottle, but it is diluted at 4ml per litre of water, so, for £20 you get 250 litres of liquid fertilizer that can be used as a soil drench, or as a foliar feed

I've been using Iguana grow for a while now and everything has responded very well, and I am switching away from synthetic fertilizers and trying the organic way now (I still currently use synthetic on lawns though)

thats the way I see it, but I may be wrong?

Sorry you are wrong, the Chempak is 25:15:15 and as a ratio that's 1.7:1:1 the Miracle Gro is 6:1:1 a MASSIVE difference !!!

OOPS ... I used a figure of 25-15-5 which works out to 5-3-1, instead of 25-15-15

a quick google, and there are different Chempack fertilizers:
Chempack Formula 2 .. 25-15-15 (works out to 5-3-3)
Chempack Formula 3 ... 20-20-20 (works out to 1-1-1)
Chempack Formula 4 ... 15-15-30 (works out to 1-1-2)
Chempack Formula 8 ... 12 1/2-25-25 (works out to 1-2-2)

I have this saved on my computer:
Chemical or Inorganic Fertilisers % N % P % K
Nitrogen Phosphate Potash
Chempack Formula 2 25-15-15
Chempack Formula 3 20 20 20
Chempack Formula 4 15 15 30
Chempack Formula 8 12½ 25 25
Growmore 7 7 7
J.A.Bowers Sangral 15 10 25
Miracle Grow 15 30 15
Miracid 30 10 10
Osmacote (typical) 10 11 18
Phostrogen 10 10 27
Phostrogen Acid Plant Food 15 10 15
Potassium sulphate 0 0 50
Superphosphate 0 20½ 0
Tomorite 4 4½ 8
Urea 47 0 0

on an old thread on the USA banana forum, it was recomended to use a fertilizer that has the following, and that was specifially formulated for musa and was called 'banana fuel':

http://wellspring100.tripod.com/id39.html

N 15.0%
P 5.0%
K 30.0%
Ca 0.0000%
Mg 0.0000%
S 1.5000%
Cl 0.0000%
B 0.0200%
Cu 0.0500%
Fe 0.1000%
Mn 0.0500%
Mo 0.0005%
Zn 0.0500%

so .... looking at the basic formula (15-5-30), none of the common fertilizers on the list have a similar ratio ...

a quick google found this one from italy with the correct ratio:
http://www.italpollina.com/Product.asp? ... 20elements

but I doubt that I will be importing fertilzer

[GaryW]

You still have it wrong on the 25:15:15 it's 1.7:1:1 not 5:3:3 !!

[GaryW]

Some of the above feeds are now superceded/modified :

Miracid is now known as Miracle Gro Azalea Camellia feed and is 16:6:16 (2.7:1:2.7)
Phostrogen is now 14:10:27 (1.4:1:2.7)
Miracle Gro is now 24:8:16 (3:1:2)

[Dim]

You still have it wrong on the 25:15:15 it's 1.7:1:1 not 5:3:3 !!

it's the same thing .... 15 divided by 5 equals 3 .... 25 divided by 5 equals 5

normally, you try and round off the numbers to whole numbers when working out fertilizer ratios .... gets a bit more complex than that, as you are supposed to work out the weight of the nitrogen to the weight of the bag or package (thats how they work out the annual weight of nitrogen needed for specific crops or lawns such as golfcourses etc)

but I'm still learning

[Dim]

found something that comes close to the banana fuel fertilizer, and I may try this combination this year (I have only planted 2 musa recently, and this is the first time I have planted them)

Advanced Nutrients Grow

http://www.camgrow.co.uk/advanced-nutrients-grow-2-1-6/

has a ratio of 2-1-6 ... costs £7.99 for 2 litres ... diluted at 8ml per US gallon of water ... (approx 2ml per litre of water) ...

add some Iguana juice grow .... for all the trace minerals etc and it could be a good thing for the Musa and does not cost much ... and is available at most hydroponic stores and ebay

a litre of each may last a whole growing season for a few musa

has a bit less nitrogen, but the Iguana Juice will add the bit extra plus a whole lot more

[tropical Tom]

^ We were talking about the Miracle Gro lawn feed not the std Miracle Gro

ahha, don't worry I'll catch up

[dino]

I'm not even trying to

[Stevo]

Thanks for all the suggestions from everybody!

Very much appreciated..

S.

[Kristen]

You still have it wrong on the 25:15:15 it's 1.7:1:1 not 5:3:3 !!

it's the same thing .... 15 divided by 5 equals 3 .... 25 divided by 5 equals 5

Indeed, but not a "safe" way to compare the "Nitrogen power" of two fertilizers.

The proportion of N in a 5:3:3 is a lot less than in a 6:1:1 - but if you express them like that the "5" looks very similar to the "6"

Probably easier to express them as percentages of the whole - so 5:3:3 (or 25:15:15) is 45%:27%:27% whereas 6:1:1 is 75%:12.5%:12.5% - nearly twice as much N-power, and only half the P & K-power

[Dim]

You still have it wrong on the 25:15:15 it's 1.7:1:1 not 5:3:3 !!

it's the same thing .... 15 divided by 5 equals 3 .... 25 divided by 5 equals 5

Indeed, but not a "safe" way to compare the "Nitrogen power" of two fertilizers.

The proportion of N in a 5:3:3 is a lot less than in a 6:1:1 - but if you express them like that the "5" looks very similar to the "6"

Probably easier to express them as percentages of the whole - so 5:3:3 (or 25:15:15) is 45%:27%:27% whereas 6:1:1 is 75%:12.5%:12.5% - nearly twice as much N-power, and only half the P & K-power

suppose you have a point, but I look at it a different way ... which works out the same ...

it's like mixing potting soil

example: 6-1-1

6 parts of N ... 1 part of P ... 1 part of K

[Kristen]

it's like mixing potting soil

example: 6-1-1

6 parts of N ... 1 part of P ... 1 part of K

It is also like that.

You can take some 3-3-3 and use twice as much and get the same effect as using some 6-6-6 (give-or-take a bit).

But 5-2-2 contains more P & K, relative to the N than 5-1-1 - so if it is "just N" that you are really after you need to look at what percentage of the N, P and K the "N" bit is.

I've got a 600Kg bag of "just N" off the local farmer - the sort of stuff they chuck on their wheat in the Spring - so I'm confident that I don't have to worry about the P & K when I use that! But it's something like 16-0-0, or maybe 20-0-0, so I have to be careful not to put it on the lawn unless it is guaranteed to rain within a few nanoseconds!

[Dim]

it's like mixing potting soil

example: 6-1-1

6 parts of N ... 1 part of P ... 1 part of K

It is also like that.

You can take some 3-3-3 and use twice as much and get the same effect as using some 6-6-6 (give-or-take a bit).

But 5-2-2 contains more P & K, relative to the N than 5-1-1 - so if it is "just N" that you are really after you need to look at what percentage of the N, P and K the "N" bit is.

I've got a 600Kg bag of "just N" off the local farmer - the sort of stuff they chuck on their wheat in the Spring - so I'm confident that I don't have to worry about the P & K when I use that! But it's something like 16-0-0, or maybe 20-0-0, so I have to be careful not to put it on the lawn unless it is guaranteed to rain within a few nanoseconds!

this might help you:
http://www.cmg.colostate.edu/gardennotes/232.pdf

snip:
Fertilizer ratio indicates a comparative proportion of nitrogen to phosphate to potash. For example, a 15-10-5 fertilizer has a ratio of 3-2-1, and an 8-12-4 fertilizer has a ratio of 2-3-1.

Fertilizer recommendations from a soil test are given in ratios.
When shopping for a fertilizer, select a product with a ratio somewhat similar to that desired. For example, if a soil test recommended a 2-1-0 ratio, the ideal fertilizer would be something like 8-4-0, 10-5-0 or 20-10-0. However, if you cannot find that exact fertilizer, an 8-4-2 would be similar. If a garden soil test calls for a 1-0-0 ratio, a 21-0-0 or 24-2-2 fertilizer would be similar.

if you scroll down a bit further on the link, it explains the nitrogen application rates for home gardens ....

it gets a lot more complex than that, as you should work out the application rate in grams per square meter (it normally tells you on the bag) ... you may find that some say 35 grams per square meter, and some say 20 grams per square meter, so this also gets factored in